011: The Value Of Physical Fitness As A Christian. With Cole Walters

I bring on Cole Walters, a friend, musician, and aspiring fitness influencer to talk about how to properly implement physical fitness into our lives. We talk about the importance of not losing ourselves and letting this become an idol.

Transcript

 , we'll just get started. Hey Cole, how's it going? It's going good. That's good. So, before we start, tell everybody a little bit about yourself and what exactly 

it is you do. Sure. , I'm 19.

Right now I'm in, , pursuit of a degree in business admin. Just headed a community college here. , Outside of that though, my personal life, I, , I love fitness. So I'm at the gym just about every day. And when I'm not, I do yoga, cardio, just about anything else to stay active. And then,  I'm a musician, so I write music and, volunteer at my church a couple of nights a week.

Just kind of keep myself level headed in. Yeah. 

Are you still at Rez? Yes. Nice. What got you into fitness in the first 

place? when I was a kid, I was, I loved video games. They're great. But I was really chubby  and I always had really bad, like self esteem issues with that. It was always super self conscious about my stomach.

And,  and as I started to get more into thinning out, trying to not be chubby,  I discovered Chris Haria. He's a calisthenics athlete. And so I got into that stuff and I think it was like, I had been doing pushups for a couple months realized I was actually building muscle and just kind of caught my interest and was like, dang, I really want to do this more seriously.

And then, I mean, did my own research and yeah, I just started to pursue it seriously and just to gain muscle, but also to keep myself healthy and I don't know, be a good example for my friends, but also my family to come eventually.  

Do you focus still more on more calisthenics or is it? Weightlifting, bodybuilding.

No. Yeah. recently I've been training bodybuilding for a couple of months. I'll say since. July of  2023, I've  been doing bodybuilding. but actually in the past month, I've kind of had, I don't know, some come to Jesus moments, if you will, about that. just about priorities and keeping my, um, my vision straight.

And so I've started to incorporate like more calisthenics work. but also, I mean, athletics, so training in soccer and that kind of thing, but also, yeah, just making sure I'm not, you know, over obsessed with all the little things and just reminding myself that I'm in the gym to stay healthy. That's 

crazy because I've been focusing a lot more on calisthenics these days too.

And I've got my young nephew who's like, dude, I'm bigger than you.  And that's just how it always goes. They're just like so obsessed with getting bigger. But then, especially at my age, when you're 30, putting on all that weight and lifting squats, heavy weight is just not worth it anymore. And calisthenics, like you still gain muscle. 

But you have more of that shredded look, which is what I prefer.  And I just, I don't get out of breath all the time. Everything else is just better in life  because it's a lot more challenging stuff like pull ups and pushups. And it's a lot higher than number like doing five by five for benching for me was always easier than doing like 20 reps of a lighter weight for whatever reason. 

my next question is, what got you into being a fitness influencer and what has that  been like as a Christian? Has it been harder?  

No, that's a, that's a great question. so let me think.  Chris Heria for sure gave me like that. Oh, that'd be so cool to do that. And originally in my brain I was like, man, dude, I could have, this is my job.

Like  I could just post videos all day. Like that'd be so sick. I get to go to the gym for my job. Like that'd be so cool. so there was that side of it. he piqued my interest, but as I kind of progressed, at first it was actually more of a accountability for myself. So when I first started doing fitness influencing, I was living in Utah, I believe, and I was away from home and I didn't necessarily have anybody pushing me out there to go to the gym.

So I was like, man, if I post content, if I can get some followers, some people intrigued, like some intrigue from some people. Then I would have like a higher desire to go to the gym or it would keep me going to the gym. Like, Oh, I can't let down all my followers, which is funny. Yeah. but as I progressed, it honestly just became more of like a, there are a ton of people.

Like when I was a kid, I was like, man, I could not go to the gym. I'm too chubby. Like everybody's going to look at me and kind of got into my head. But the more that I went to the gym and the more that I posted content, it almost became more of like a, No, everybody can do this, like, it's okay to be healthy and it's okay to pursue that no matter what you look like, being healthy is important, it should be a priority and you should take care of the body because you only have one, you can't exchange it for another one at the store or something like that, you gotta really take care of it, and especially like you were saying with lifting weights, way later down the road,  like, you gotta take care of yourself because if not, My grandparents aren't in a very good physical shape and it's because they chose not to take care of themselves and so  for sure I don't, like, one of my grandparents had told me when I was a kid, he said, I'm not going to be the grandpa that's on the floor and can't get back up and he's been, well, what does he do?

He, that's funny. I just had a weird, uh, mind freeze. no, he, he has his own farm and he's been farming for 20 years. He's almost 75 years old. 75 I think and he's still up and like maintains his entire farm every single morning He's got horses cows pigs goats chickens And like tends to them and it's a huge farm And he's still cracking like can still kind of walk around and do all that stuff And and so for me that that's kind of been the bigger thing for for social media It's just that everybody can do it  now on the spiritual side of things.

It's been really, really good. I've been able to kind of incorporate, I mean, verses and what the Bible says about taking care of yourself. but also kind of show like,  like it's, it's okay to still want to put a lot of time into going to the gym as long as it doesn't become an idol. Which it did.

So out in Utah, I actually got a trainer and that was fine. And it was a lot of fun. It was super expensive. So I was probably spending close to 800 a month, 800 a month. So it was 165 for his monthly fee just to have him as a trainer. Yeah.  food. So he had me, I had, I was five meals a day. I was eating a pound of ground lean beef and a pound of ground turkey every single day or okay.

Eight ounces. Some days I would have a 16 ounces. So a pound or half pound to a pound.  The turkey would be rough. And out there a pound of lean ground turkey was 12. So I was buying six or seven each week. it was doing all that.  And that was completely fine. but initially when I moved out there, it was, Hey, I'm going to come out here and I'm going to serve and I'm going to pursue the Lord and really chase my faith out here.

Uh huh. Get away from My childhood and all the people I've ever known and fall under new authority. So fall under Josh and Jasmine instead of my parents. Yeah, um and just pursue like my own future like my if my if I really want to be in college all that kind of Stuff and I went to the gym and like everything else froze  I was like, oh, I love the gym and I love making content and all and I like there was one day when I got like  Cause he was like, Hey man, we need to go move this desk for the church.

And I was like, I'm going to miss my meal.  And he like looked at me and he was like, all right, stay home. And then talk to me later. And he was like, man, why are you out here? But anyways, that to be said,  yeah, it, uh, it's definitely raised its, uh, its own issues trying to find the healthy balance, but that in and of itself, like I was saying, trying to incorporate calisthenics and, athletic training and making sure I'm not training just to look good.

 I, I like not looking like I don't lift weights. Yeah. But it's also , it got to the point where I was like, man, if I don't have a six pack, , I'm a weakling. I don't even deserve to be on this app. And so, being a Christian, like, God kind of checked my heart and was like, Hey, man, like, , Why really are you in the gym?

, are you self conscious about what you look like? Or are you in the gym because I'm telling you it's healthy and cause you should be taking care of your temple. And that happened and I was like, dude, like, holy crap. All right, I'll, I'll relax. And so that kind of was my, I took a little break and kind of recentered myself and it's okay to want to look good and it's okay to notice change.

But, um, it's really, really important that we just, I don't know, honor God with the bodies he gave us and take care of ourselves.  

How has the physical fitness.  Has it poured into your spiritual life at all? 

Oh, for sure.  There's a, like, working out's great, but there's a certain level of discipline that comes with that.

Like, I've been seeing a ton of stuff online. Like, I follow a lot of motivation accounts, like, keep myself, like, okay, I gotta keep my head in it, why not?  But there is a level of discipline that comes with going to the gym  and, like, Seeing people that are really big,  like they don't just go to the gym or like two or three times or even seeing change in myself.

Like I've been in the gym, I mean seriously, probably for about two years now, like actually going, going, going, and there's been change, but it's slow and you can't necessarily base your success off your change. But with that, the discipline that I've found in going to the gym and like, now you gotta get up every single day, you gotta go, and you gotta push hard.

Or else you're not gonna change near as much as you want to.  Has kinda poured into my spiritual because God's been like, man, you really seem to push really hard at the gym. But then when it gets to me and you, you push me hard on Thursday and on Sunday, but then what happens Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, and Friday?

Like I completely drop off your radar. And it like happened at a Sunday service. I was sitting there  and I had heard it so many times, but like people always say, you can't have a Sunday faith. You can't have a Sunday faith. I was like, I don't have a Sunday. The staple of our generation.  But I heard it again and I was like, dude, like, I don't just go to the gym two times a week.

Like I'm there every single day for two hours. Like, I, I don't do cardio as much as I should, but I'm there for two hours pushing hard every single set. I'm giving everything I can. And I'm not even willing to give the creator of the universe 20 minutes of my time every morning to just sit there and pray or read my Bible or worship on the way to work.

And so it definitely like gave me a big heart check. Cause I was like,  man, my discipline and my fitness is far from my discipline and my spirituality and my spirituality should be far over what my discipline for my, Physicality is and so that's been uh, that's been real for me recently  

I think too When it comes to the discipline is if you're going to the gym  Maybe you're starting off and you're like I can eat whatever I want, but at some point You have to switch over to a healthier food option.

Yeah. It may take years. It might be after months. For me, it took years. And then once you start eating healthy, it's like, okay, now my mind is a little bit more clear and I'm starting to get better sleep. So then now I'm waking up earlier and then you start to, you realize that you have all this time before work.

Boom. Bible time, prayer time, journal time. So I think that, yeah, I don't think there's enough emphasis on the fact that physical fitness can actually pour into the spiritual. As long as, like, what happened with you doesn't become an idol. Right.  And then with that, when you first started off, what was it like to overcome the fear of people might judge you? 

That honestly, I think came over time. Honestly, I went with my dad a lot and um,  he was like on a fitness curve, like crave. He was like, I think he was two.  Oh gosh, I don't want to mess this up.  I don't remember if he hit 300 plus, but he was, he was big and he was like, I got to lose weight. Like I gotta, I'm unhealthy.

This is not okay.  And so he was going, Oh, he was going, and it was kind of like,  it's like, man, my dad, in my brain, I was like, man, I'm not as big as my dad, but he seems like nothing matters. Like he's just here to put in the work. And so for me, I was like.  Man, I'm not, I'm not that big. Like I can do it.

I can do this. And so my dad definitely helped. And when I started going by myself, it was like a completely different story. Cause then I, as I went by myself, I didn't like have my dad to talk to. And so I was like noticing everybody around me and all these kids are twigs cause they grew up with the lowest body fat percentage ever.

And I'm this chubby kid trying to put in the work and put on muscle cause I'm, I got a really weird belt.  And it kind of came over time, it came with thinning out, and then it also just kind of  came with like, choosing a new mindset.  So whenever I'm like, I would go in or even now, if I feel like, man, I feel like I'm kind of bloated or I feel like I'm not in good shape. 

It's just like, like, what's my basis? What am I basing health out of? am I basing health from all these social media influencers who may or may not be dosing or who  have maybe for sure. 

Right. Majority of them. It's like that comes out and here 

they are juicing. Yeah. Um, like in my basing health off of that, or am I basing health off of, okay, I am putting to ours.

of my time and of my energy into the gym to be healthy. Like some of the healthiest people or even some of the best athletes might not even be the most muscular, but they take care of themselves. Like you don't have to have big muscles or even have a six pack in that regard to be healthy. Like I think everybody should have goals, but eventually, which I think had actually happened, I want to say it was last summer right before I moved out to Utah.

It was just a really weird day. Like I got up and I got out of got to the gym and I was like, man, I feel different. Like I feel, I feel good.  And then from there on out, like it was. It was just different. Like every single time I'd be like, man, I'm not feeling good.  And I'd be like, okay, well what am I basing it off of?

Like am I basing it off of like Alex Eubank? Who's got the craziest genetics ever or is dosing or whatever. Or am I basing it off the time that I'm in my own work? Like what I know I'm doing instead of what the industry is telling me I need to be doing. And so, I mean, after that, now it's just been like, yeah, I don't have a six pack and I might not be the most lean, but I take care of myself and  I can lift some pretty heavy weight for my age.

And I'm at the gym almost every single day. So it's like, I feel like that that in and of itself speaks health. But yeah, 

I think once the effort becomes the reward, Is when you really start to see the results.  But what was it like when you were becoming a fitness influencer? Were you worried about that people judging you on? 

Actually, that actually wasn't crazy hard when I was like a kid and they're still up on  Still up on up on YouTube. I used to  I used to make like stupid videos. So I had like one I think I was so we had moved in I had at least be 10 It's probably 11 or 12. I made like these stupid little videos about like my lego connection or I think my first video My first video was called eating takis and showing you my legos That was the whole title and there was like no description and it was literally me like playing with a toy in my hands Talking to the camera eating takis like out of a bowl.

I made out of legos or something like that  And uh, you ever think about going back? Um, but anyways, so I made content when I was younger and, now that I'm older and more mature,  um, the comments really didn't, , they don't really mean anything.  Even if there's somebody who's like, like, what are you doing?

Get off this app. It's just kind of like, I'm not really here. I'm not posting on Tik Tok or posting on Instagram or whatever the social media platform is  because I need validation from people. I'm more posting to say, Hey, you can do this. Like, Anybody can do this and it's not the follower count that defines your worth.

It's not any of that. And so when I was becoming an influencer, I definitely was obsessed with like, okay, I got to figure out this algorithm. Okay. What did Alex post? What did Joe Manella post? What did Skylar Reeves, whatever the, my top influencers post. Okay. What kind of content did they post? How long were their videos?

What kind of eye catchers did they use? but the mental battle for me wasn't even there. Like there was a couple of videos where I was like, man, I put a lot of work into that and it didn't do very well. Or like it didn't get as many views as my other ones, like the ones that were stupid short and a stupid skit that I fought thought of when I was at work.

but other than that it became, I mean, pretty easy, like, okay, I'm just posting content for the fun of it, but also like. Just to kind of show that you don't have to have 100k plus followers to post content and to be happy and enjoy it, so. 

was there a point at which the views did start to consume you at all?

I had one video that I posted actually, it was when I was home, so I think it was in December, I want to say. I was working third shift at Amazon and I made a video like, it was with some stupid TikTok sound. And it like, it did the best now, like my view counts aren't high just cause it's, it's definitely not a basis for what the content, like, I don't, Oh, that one did.

Well, I have to post another one like that. Like I was like, Oh, that one did. Well, that's kind of cool. Yeah. And so I posted one with the tick tock sound and it got like, I think 1400 views and it was quick. Like it was within an hour. And I was like, shoot, that's actually really good. And so after that, my brain was kind of like, man, this could be a real thing.

And I was like, I'm going to keep doing this. And like the next five videos after that, it was like 200, 150, like going down. And I was like, okay, like it was just a good heart check. Jesus was like, all right, make sure you're paying attention to the right thing. Yeah. And so it was, it was easy just to kind of  like, for a second, I was like,  I like how that feels.

Like that's a big number. And then Jesus was like, hold on, you're not doing it for the number. Like you're doing it because of these reasons. And don't forget it. if you get focused on the number, your views are going to tank. So  

I had to start posting it and then deleting the app because I couldn't. 

I can easily get obsessed with, like you, you uh, refresh it and then see how much it goes up in like each second and it's just, I don't know, that's just me. So I have to post and then immediately delete. Yeah. Whatever social media platform I put it on. Yeah, and maybe that's something that I overcome  At some point but right for me.

It was just Yeah, that's how I have to do it. So I definitely get it with 1400. It's like, oh, yeah, this might be a Yeah, right. This is a real 

thing. It's happening It's funny because you can like you can go in and you can see engagement. So after like three or four days, You can actually see the posts engagement.

So how, when people stopped watching and where it waned out, how many seconds it was in most of the videos, especially in that one, it was the first two seconds it was at its peak. And then right after that, it was like doom and dropped. And like everybody left after the first two seconds cause they had all seen the trend or whatever.

It was like a trending, a trending sound or whatever. And so they saw it. And then left right away. So I actually didn't get a lot of like, not collaboration, but like nobody actually liked it or anything. Like it was just the instant, okay. They scrolled that counts as a view. And then they left and I was like,  all right, that makes sense.

Like that's probably why it was so big.  But yeah, 

how do we separate the difference between  posting the thirst trap versus I'm a fitness 

influencer?  

Yeah. I think, oh gosh, that's a good one. I'd say,  I don't know if anything I've ever posted, I would count as a thirst trap, like even raw physique updates, which just means like no pump, no.

No gym, you roll out of bed, so whatever the last meal is, was in you, that's what they'd see. No pump, it's, you just literally get out of bed and pose or whatever.  And so I wouldn't say that. I think that  very quickly, just as a society, we can sexualize the gym and our bodies, and Yeah. I mean, that's partially a reason why I'm not so obsessed with getting a six pack anymore.

Cause, I mean, originally I was like, I want a six pack cause it looks cool. And then my brain was like, What's your wife gonna think about that? And then I was like, oh, she'll probably like it. He was like,  hey, you should do it because of that. Like, just be obsessed with what your future wife's gonna think about you.

And it kind of almost devalued myself. my wife isn't gonna love me if I don't have a six pack, if I'm not shredded. and so I think that  it definitely has to be like, in the Bible it tells us to be steadfast in our faith. And I think that means even in content creation, we have to be super careful With not kind of making content idly because that stuff will sneak its way in without us knowing, like, even if it's just a smirk at the camera while you're pulling or like that kind of thing, like it, it really can just like, Hmm, like that, that looks kind of wrong or that looks kind of off putting or there's a lot of influencers I know that will, or I saw a video actually.

I used to like be obsessed with posing when I first started. I had a really, it was really bad for a couple of months cause I gotta learn how to pose. Like I can make myself look bigger. And based off how you pose, if you vacuum, bring your chest up, like you can make your muscles look a lot bigger than they actually are. 

But there was one and it was like basically like not putting your pants where they're supposed to sit and pulling them down slightly cause it will show your V taper better.  And I was like, freaking out about it. And I was like, I feel really uncomfortable right now. Like, this is not, like, I should be doing this. 

And I remember there was, there was one day when I was like at home recording content, I was loving it.  And Josh came in the door and he was like,  what are you doing?  And I like got all red face. I was like, ah, dude, like. 

Oh, I can't, I can 

feel the embarrassment. I'm posting some content. He was like,  alright.

He was like, what video is that about? I was like,  nothing, nevermind. And I never ended up posting it, but it was, it was like, I don't know, Jesus came in and even checked my heart in that moment and was like, yeah, why are you so uncomfortable right now? Like, why don't you, why can't you post this? And I was like, yeah, you're right.

Like this is, this is kind of not, this is, I'm trailing off to a place I don't want to go. so yeah, I mean that was kind of a, kind of a long answer, but  yeah, I think being steadfast and being intentional with what we're posting, like you got to make sure you're, like, don't just follow trends. I made a video about that actually when I first started. 

It was, um, one of my main things is I was like, I want to  bring our generation closer to Christ. Show them that you can be a fitness influencer while chasing the Lord. but also not be a trend follower. So like I don't just post the latest trends or the latest sounds. I make it a emphasis, like for example, for most of my podcast esque videos, I made a couple of them about what's power building  one about consistency.

another one about like my top three back exercises or whatever.  But in most of those, videos, or I think in two of them, I actually used my own music. So music that I produced myself and I put it underneath to make sure I wasn't using trending sounds from Tik Tok because I didn't want my views to be based off of the sound.

Right. I wanted my views to be based off. Okay. People actually find interest in my knowledge and what I have to share. Yeah. And you and what you have to say. Right. Not because. Okay, there's some really sad sounding TikTok thing that everybody knows like, Oh, this is going to be like a really good quote or something. 

I want it to be authentic. I want it to be okay. No, this is me. This is what I have thought of this is.  And so yeah, I definitely. 

That is hard not to get caught up in is you want to post something. So I stopped posting them with music at all. I'll do the captions so people can listen to it. No sound.  But I've noticed that there's always some song in the background.

It's like this inspirational or sad thing.  And it's just like, I don't even remember those videos because I was just there for the content, not actually what was being taught or said,  , do you ever worry about losing yourself in the fame or whatever you want to call it? 

Should you ever get big and, and then fully putting Jesus aside? Is there any fear that that could happen?  

There is, that's actually been a really real thought. Especially recently and I'm talking like in the past week  because I've been  writing a lot of music This is kind of on a different scale, but even in fitness influencing as well, both of my accounts I've been posting stuff that I really love.

Yeah, and I've posted two of my videos the most recently that have gotten the most  Engagement so the most views and the most likes on both accounts  I've done it and and I have had thoughts like not just being tiktok famous, but like seriously like okay If I if I actually do this like and I take a couple classes I could start my own gym or if my music blows up like I could be I could be a real musician and I just kind of have been running through different dreams and like  Like man, I could like I could be okay A millionaire is kind of aggressive, but I can make a lot of money from just making music and doing my dreams  and for that I have thought about that and my brain's been like man like all the house i'm gonna have all the car i'm gonna have  and then i've been like Dude, like what am I here for?

And so it's been a real thought. It's like my my initial flesh is like, okay Yeah, that's gonna be sick Like I could have I could start my own brand like all that kind of stuff super cool things but then my  My heart gets checked and Jesus is like, okay. Yeah, but why are you even here? Like what's the point of all this not just of the content not just of your music, but like why did I put you here?

He's like it's definitely not to have a nice car or a nice house Like although he can give me those things and although I can be blessed by those things. Yeah Like, it's not my purpose, truthfully, to do anything other than spread the gospel and grow his kingdom. And so it's then, it's come and go, like I'll have nights where I'm like, dude, this could be real.

And I'll put in hours of work editing a video or doing some stupid, funny edits to try and get more engagement. But  very quickly I'm like, okay, yeah, but why am I,  why am I actually here? Like what am I, what am I doing? Like what's my actual, my life's calling, not just what I'm doing when I'm 19 years old.

What's going to bring you the most 

fulfillment. Right. And it's.  Obviously Jesus, right? But we don't always think that way.  And I wonder if there's any value to that balance where it's like there is days, cause I have the exact same thing where I'm plugged away at my computer trying to just create a little short,  which can take time if you want it to look good and have the captions all lined up. 

And so I wonder if there's any value to the balance of Cause I don't want to say like, Oh yeah, sometimes you should follow your flesh. I think that's really probably a dumb thing to say. Right. But do you think that there's any value ever to falling into that? Like putting a bunch of hard work into something? 

Yeah. I think that  this is where it gets super tough because like, um, God, the great commission when Jesus told us to go out and to be, and to be disciples, like of him and. Um, I think that that was our true calling. So the thing we were supposed to do with our entire life was just to spread his word and to grow his kingdom.

Like, that's truthfully our sole purpose.  But if that was like our only, only purpose, right? It could be our sole purpose. So what our hearts, where our hearts will find the most fulfillment, but if that was our sole purpose, none of us would be working. None of us would be in the workforce. That'd be a secular thing that we should stay away from.

And we would, you be on the streets, like doing that, not saying you can't evangelize in your workplace or anything like that.  but truthfully, I do think that there's God gave us gifts for a reason. I find myself as an okay editor. Like I enjoy it. I'm passionate about it, but also music. Like I'm really passionate about music and writing music.

And I don't think that God would have given me those things had he not had preconceived notions of what I would do with them. Not saying that I can't use those to grow his kingdom because I can make I can make videos about a verse and put music in the background that I wrote or something like that.

But I also think that as long as we're chasing God first and putting him first, he'll bless every other area of our life. that's why our sole goal should not be to get a really nice house and not get a really good car. But when we put God first, we get blessed with a really nice house and we get blessed with a really nice car or we have the ability to be blessed with that kind of thing.

And so I think that it does bring, Some type of balance and I think that it's healthy, but I also think, like my dad, my dad's been preaching at me a lot recently.  That work isn't always fun. Like work isn't always gonna be like, man, I love this. Like he says that a lot of the time. Like  he's like, I love my job.

And he is like, but there are days when I'm like, man, I hate my job . It's always gonna be a job. Right? Yeah. And so. So, with that, I think that having that discipline, even if it's something you don't love doing, like there are some videos that I've made where I've been like halfway through and I'm like, this just sucks.

Like, I don't even enjoy this. Like, this video is going to flop. I already know it. Like, just having down on myself a little bit.  But that being said, I think that there's some sort of discipline and same thing with the gym and with Jesus and pursuing the Lord is having discipline in things and being able to say, okay, no, I'm going to sit down and I'm going to finish this.

I'm going to do this to the best of my ability, not even for myself. But for the Lord, so this video is going to be bomb, and I'm going to make sure it's perfect exactly how I want it.  Not for my own glory, but because God calls me to do everything to the best of my ability. So.  

Alright, well, we're at about a half hour, so I think that's a perfect place to end this episode.

Yeah. I think we covered a lot of stuff. And thank you for coming on. Appreciate it. 

Yeah. Thank you for having me. It was a pleasure. Yeah. 

We'll have to have you back sometime. Alright, everybody. Thanks for listening. Bye. 

Bye.